Minutes from V&G Working Group 12/22/11

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Time: 5:35pm

First half of meeting Attendees:


Sumumba Sobukwe (1rst Half of Meeting Minute Taker)

Micheal Corn (Second Half of Meeting Minute Taker)

Mike Hayes (Facilitator)

Patrick Conway (Stack Taker)

Rich Wozernzki




Agenda Items Agreed Upon by Group included:

I. Key Holder/Default 24 Hr. List-Staffing of Office@50 Broadway (December 29, 2011)-Sumumba

II. EGO vs/ Movement (Community Agreements)-Sumumba

III. Goals Sub Group-Patrick and Sumumba

IV. Feedback from General Assembly, Spokescouncil and Online Community-Patrick and Entire Group

(The following is totally paraphrased so please don’t shoot the transcriber! Thanks.)


I. The Key Holder, 24 Hour Access and Staffing of Front Desk agenda item was led by Sumumba who basically explained how each facet worked. The group consented that Sumumba would be key holder and be on default list for 24 hour access. Sumumba also mentioned the prospect of having meetings over the holiday to continually hash out the Vision statement as well as possibly starting the Goals Sub-group (which is a later agenda item). Sumumba also mentioned the December 29th staffing of 50 Broadway 12th Floor. Micheal Korn said he’d help staff the desk from 1pm-5pm and Sumumba from 9am-1pm and 5pm-9pm. No one else volunteered to help with staffing from 1pm-5pm and if no one else volunteers before December 29th Sumumba would staff with Micheal Korn which group agreed upon by show of hands. No one on stack. 3 minutes

II. The EGO vs. MOVEMENT-This agenda/discussion item was also led Sumumba, who spoke briefly about the Vision Document as NOT belonging or being authored by ONE person but is a GROUP EFFORT. Sumumba opined that  EDGING GOD OUT AND EARTH GUIDE ONLY were the acronyms for EGO and that their had been a couple of individuals who have tried to derail the group either consciously or unconsciously by their insistence on being the MAIN or SOLE author of the Vision statement. Sumumba went on to further state that this movement is bigger than any ONE man or woman and that the group needs to focus its effort on completing it’s mission. 3 minutes No one on stack.

III. Both Sumumba and Patrick led the discussion on a Goals Subgroup. Sumumba informed group that it could meet over the holiday season if it wished to start the connecting goals to the vision statement and if the group was interested it could speak with Sobukwe about the possibility. 2 Minutes. Patrick mentioned that a Solution/Structure Cluster Group had formed and that would be a ‘great’ way to to begin the process of  collecting data about the goals of OWS. 2minutes. No one on stack for either point of agenda

IV. FEEDBACK FROM General Assembly, Spokescouncil and Online Community.

Micheal Korn-‘Before we get started, I’d like to talk about the importance of us being on time! It’s really getting to be a problem, where we don’t get enough done because we run out of time and it’s really pissing me off!’

Sumumba-‘If the meetings are set to start at 5:30 we should be here a bit early to set the agenda i feel’

Micheal Korn-‘Well we need to just make sure we get here, I don’t know if we need to change the time or what’?

Patrick-‘We’ve changed the days and times a few times before and you see where that’s got us!’ *Laughter from group*

Sumumba-‘I think we need to get BOTH the Visions and Goals done by Martin Luther King’s Birthday January 15..How do you feel about that Patrick?’

Patrick-‘I think that’s a good idea but we just want to get the best document we can out!’

Micheal Korn-‘ok let’s just all make sure we get here on time for the rest of the meetings!’

Micheal Hayes (Facilitator)-‘ok let’s begin the discussion on feedback’

Stack: Sumumba, Micheal Korn, and Patrick

Sumumba-‘I say we’ve collected enough feedback online, I mean we have 10 pages worth! How does everyone feel about taking feedback overall.

Micheal Korn-‘January 1 would be a good date to stop taking feedback I’d say.

Patrick-‘As long as we get quality document out we don’t have to feel pressed for time’

Group goes deeper into feedback and Visions Document:






Georgi-‘I think we need to add natural and nutricious food to the document, I think as a vision statement this would be good and the world does have the capacity to produce both versus the junk and unhealthy food available now!’

Micheal Korn-‘Well many people can’t afford the ‘organic’ stuff and they have eat what’s available right now, let’s be very aware of that folks!’

Sumumba-‘I think that this as a part of a VISION statement would also be a goal and or something we would strive to help create, we just need the poetic and creative language’

Marie-‘Speaking of Goals I have a document available for this group to consider as well’ **Marie hands out document**

**SUMUMBA exits meeting to attend the Brooklyn General Assembly Micheal Korn takes over minutes**

Time: 7:13PM

Patrick: Jack suggested a change to the education clause which was previously taken out of it’s original place in the document. I think it should be considered more of a goal than a vision.

Sati – I like what Jack said. Could be part of goals. Even Lisa or Dorje’s could.

Michael K.: I think we should combine the sections People Before Profits and Meeting Human Needs.

Michael H.: Should we extend this meeting to 8:00PM. No objections…consensed to.

Rich: What do you think of adding “free humanistic and empowering education” to the education section? Reasoning is so we wouldn’t have education just to be cogs in the economic machinery. People need to redefine their careers. Prepare people for newer, more creative and different work in the 21st century.

—Dinner Break For 5 Minutes—

Patrick: Let’s keep working at rewording the education clause.

Jack: I think it’s something like Frank Lloyd Wright said about Form and Function. Vision is more like the forms; Goals the function.

Pat: I don’t disagree with your for wanting to highlight education as a single bullet point.

Shoshanna: HEW is already created. We have the right  to insist on housing and employment and it must be high quality and full access.

Dorje: Education should based on mastery of a given subject.

Sati: Housing and Healthcare could be split into two bullet points. Since education is what separates us from animals, it ‘s important enough to earn it’s place as a separate bullet point. I think Jacks’s sentence is good.

Rich: Propose a trade. Condense People Before Profit and Meeting Human Needs to read; whereby we value human dignity and needs over monetary gain, and human needs are elevated to a place of primary importance; among these are the right meaningful and rewarding work; decen housing; comprehensive healthcare and nutritious food supplies.

Shoshannah: We should have a framework to pin our goals, to develop our issues. Goals are where people meet in small groups or large to solve problems. Visions need to be punched out point by point.

Sati: Rich’s statement should be voted on.

Jack: HEW is already in there, so Education should be something separate.

Sati: Since education is a human need, it shouldn’t be taken out of that bullet point.

Patrick: Explains our procedures to Bibi, who just came over to our group to sit in.

Lisa: I like Rich’s statement. The use of adjectives has to describe exactly what you are for.

Dorje: Education should be a student’s evolution but ability is the promoter.

Patrick: We have spoken a long time on education. Our original feedback reflects an older iteration.

Lisa: Comments that we should add that education should be “challenging, inspiring, and free.”

Shoshanna: All of society’s basic needs should be provided for free.

Dorje: Could we make education it’s own bullet point?

Jack: When talk about things like housing and comprehensive healthcare we shouldn’t be only talking about current issues. Talk about the significant and the profound, also daring ideas.

Pat: Time to wrap this portion up. Let’s do a temp check.

Shoshanna: No trouble taking verbiage out. Basics provided; I have no problem with this. I’ve also put together my suggestions as to what order the sections should be numbered in the document. They read: Peace, Fairness & Accountability, Meeting Human Needs, Environmental Stewardship, Liberty, Equality, Just Governance and Solidarity.

Bibi: Spiritual, religious , physical outreach. We need to meet people face to face to talk about our need for liberty. Somehting that we provide for everyone. How do we link ourselves together instead of being separate.

Rich: Ok. I think we have a completed section. Reads:

People Before Profits: whereby we value human dignity and needs over monetary gain, elevating them to a place of primary importance; among these are the rights to a meaningful and fairly rewarded work; a decent home; natural and nutritious food supplies; and free, comprehensive healthcare and education.

Passes by consensus….Ho Ho Ho….We are outta here!





One Response to “Minutes from V&G Working Group 12/22/11”

  1. Urgyen Thupten Dorje

    the edits we all ended agreeing on as is shown at the end of the minutes was for the HUman Needs point not the People before profit point