Meeting minutes Nov. 29

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Seven people present at 7:20.

Group decided to have an informal discussion instead.


We discussed getting the JFA forum flier distributed at 4:00 PM. Herald Square to Union Square.

Need to go to GA and make announcement.

Talked about possible new demands (debt, Glass Steagall, and corporate personhood, nationalizing banks).


Itzak talked about Rick’s “corporate personhood”; Cecily and Eric M. talked about Walter’s “get money out of politics” demand.


Official meeting started at 7:45.

Leah volunteers to take stack

Cecily agreed to facilitate.


Cecily: Does anyone need to be briefed on hand symbols? The only thing different about our group is that we work on a 3/4 system consensus. Also explained stack.

Report backs.

Eric L: Thanks to Leah we now have a room. I’m reporting back from JFA. We have a place, date, time. Tuesday Dec. 13, 8-10 PM, 66 W. 12th St. Room 407. WBAI will broadcast it. Not necessarily live. Also web cast. Already been co-endorsed by Labor Outreach and OWS En Enspanol. There will be a big demonstration Dec. 1. NYC CLC has called a rally under jobs and fairness. Herald Square at 4PM. What we need: is anyone other than myself be at the rally? Will probably continue after 5. I would say, probably until 6 or 7. So, the other thing is that we still need a video guy. Someone who can take professional quality video.

Cecily: point of information, sometimes students will be able to do this.

Josh: I think it my contact might work.

Eric L: It’s important that people circulate and download this to list they’re on. Finally, some of us are going to the Labor Outreach Committee. Cosponsor, on Friday, at 6PM. DC 37. Right next to Path. So probably, I don’t know, they will probably discuss the forum.

Susan: I have a phone meeting with Chuck Bell from National Jobs for All Coalition.

Eric L: To keep the panel small, it will have one representative from each endorsing group. Our own group, Labor outreach, OWS en Espanol, Jobless, People’s Organization for Progress, and Occupy Harlem. Subgroup will have to have a special meeting to work out the agenda. Our group will have to decide on the speech.

Greg: Do we have a contact with Occupy Harlem? We can’t reach Nelly with the information she gave us. Was she our contact.

Cecily: Anymore report backs. Anyone have any proposals for agenda.

Greg: Discuss where we are with Economic Security and Rights subgroup.

Steven: Possibly do we want to move to once a week meetings.

Itzak: 1 minute item. For the next meeting, briefing all of us about the JFA resolution. Many of us are unclear as to how it happened.

Eric: Point of information: I did have such a document. I think it’s posted to the website. I will check if I did.

Xxx: I want to discuss how we will do outreach for the forum.

Eric M: I’d like to make sure everyone knows what’s going with the get money out idea and our plan to forward that on Sunday.

Michael: Corporate personhood?

Itzak: I will say a few words about it.

Cecily: What we’ve got so far is:

  1. economic security and rights
  2. meeting logistics
  3. JFA outreach
  4. money out of politics
  5. corporate person hood.

We need to decide on an order. Does anyone have a reason for why there’s should come up first.

Eric M.: Order for discussion?

Itzak: Short ones first

Cecily: Debrief Jobs For All (3 Minutes)?

Itzak: Issue of corporate personhood- certain decision of Supreme Court, 1870s (?). 14th Amendment did not just apply to human beings, but also to corporations. We demand that the government which gives charters to corporations to take away such rights. And it would need an amendment to the constitution. Maybe a few more. I’d try to distribute to our list-serve.

Robert: background to the laws of corporations? Corporate personhood, 14th amendment was used to deny/justify to get people to work very long hours, because it would interfere with their 14th amendment rights. One question> when you say person, do you mean all laws affecting formation of corporations,or just political rights?

Itzak: What I mean, any law, that constitution gives rights to people, those are for flesh and blood people. The gov’t should be able to pass laws a stringent or lax as it wants. But no way should the corporation say it has rights under the constitution, like free speech or equal protection. The get freedom of speech, freedom of protection, should not apply to organizations.

Cecily: do people want this conversation to continue?

Michael: sometimes organizations should have rights. Like unreasonable search and seizure. That might lead to hurting laws that protect us as well. I am worried about tyrannical issues.

Eric M: I think you’re focusing on a line by line.

Cecily: point of process: these are good question.

Itzak: we’re not debating the merits of the proposal.

Cecily: Anyone could join any subgroup. You can participate in the subgroup to address these issues.

Can we move to next ones. Remaining is another short one would be weekly meetings.

Steven: Could we do a temperature check about whether we have enough people to have a temperature check.

Cecily: stack opened to discuss this.

Eric: i support going to a weekly meeting, I don’t think this is the right time to make the decision. We had more on Sunday. I think the Sunday meeting would be the more appropriate meeting. We should we have a discussion then. We should meet on Sunday. It’s the larger meeting. In principle, in favor.

Cecily: can we limit to 4 minutes.

The only reason I would say for 2 meetings, 2 meetings seem positive in that the number of people have been able to make one meeting or another. But the problem is that everyone is not present at one meeting.

Itzak: We should make the decision on Sunday. We should discuss now. I want to make the decision based on what people are willing to participate in. I’d like to canvass people general between now and Sunday. Through the forum we could discuss this.

Cecily: Clarifying question. Chavisa didn’t know there was a meeting. Was this posted.

Josh: I actually was trying to figure this out when I first joined in. When I went to the site, I didn’t see anything until early December.

Eric: I’ll double check it.

I’m going to echo Alvin, I think given the urgency, we should meet twice a week. We should have this vote with such a small group.

Steven: I’m happy to move this meeting to once a meeting. There are subgroup, and there have been attempts to shut this group down. It should be replaced with an informal bar discussion.

Cecily: There were two meetings on a Tuesday where that happened. We could discuss an informal meeting.

Greg: Wednesday or something. What you might consider, Sunday is the best time to make a decision. Wednesday could be a time for subgroups to get together. Evidently, subgroups have already met.

Cecily: we’re at time.

Susan: I think Thursdays are a good day for a mid week meeting.

Cecily: Left on the agenda is discuss economic security and rights group. Should we include outreach of the forum. Also, money out of politics announcement.

Eric M: On Sunday, we will be forwarding a three person group to froward a demand to the next stage. Get money out will be forwarded.

Greg: Has the three person group opened up to who is interested?

Eric M: I don’t know the details about how it was forwarded through the process. They’ve had meetings outside.

Cecily: Point of information. Walter asked me to come too. I think that it’s been a group of people interested in a particular demand. Have been networking and outreaching. It may or may not be the same.

Susan: Can there be enough paper copies.

Eric L: 30-35.

Cecily: can I retroactively add something to the agenda. Talking about how to get more people back to the meetings. Seems to be some disconnect.

Next: planning outreach. 5 minutes.

Stack is open.

Itzak: Electronic media. Someone send me something similar to this. I will post it to several listserves of which I am a member. I will even post to my facebook page. This is ???. This is very minimal.

Robert: You wanted suggestions? I am a member of the UFT and their next delegate assembly which is all the chapter leaders will be at 52 Broadway, where people can hand out fliers. December 7. Wednesday. From 4-6 PM. I will be there. I can pass out some. I will also be passing out stuff. We’re trying to get a resolution at the UFT for Glass Steagall. Someone from this group should also be there. They have 800 delegates and other people coming in. 4-6.

Cecily: I’m speaking at a seminar tomorrow with 200 people. I’ll put this out. And I’ll contact the group that been in contact with this group. I can also contact with Free School press and circulate around the school.

Greg: Interestingly there is meeting at NJ Education Association 7th, Afternoon, on jobs, so I can’t speak. Trenton.

Eric: I think this would be good to have a Facebook event page. If someone here is Facebook friendly, you can set up a page.

Itzak: We can get it through the list serve

Josh: I work at Pratt. I can reach out with their group. I also do multimedia for the school, I can do graphic design.

Peter: do you have any interest in this being on public access TV. Like Brooklyn Public Television.

Eric L: But a prominent website would be better.

Cecily: We OK to adjourn soon.

Greg: Brief history of the two demands. I remember in October we had a long list. I finally just threw everything on the page. People said yes and got folks signed up. There’s been feedback, and some concerns about broad general demands. Taking the input, I’ve modified them to have one preamble for economic security and also a longer title for the rights demands. Minor modifications. I can easily put in bullet points. Pass along.

I’m going read the title. I would like to discuss. We haven’t met either.

Cecily: 5 minutes?

Greg: Demand an end to all repressive measures to intimidate and silence the voices of the 99%.

Eric: the rights could use a preface, something about the condition we’re in and the stepping up of oppressive measures. Something punch could be made. So, on the other hand, the economic security demand has had some of the same questions. What are decent economic conditions for the 99%. (read the preambles). We should get back together Sunday 5 and 5: 30 to discuss.

Temp check (positive).

So why don’t we rights first and economic security second. That would 5 and 5:30. I will distribute to email list.

Cecily: You can contact Eric for the OWS page. Any questions?

How do you feel about outreach for demands group outreach in general?

Josh and Chavisa said they didn’t know there were meetings. Seems like there’s not as much activity in yahoo groups. Is that we’re moving to the webpage.

Susan: send out personal email to people you know

Cecily; Maybe do a note that three demands are being brought on Sunday besides jobs for all.

Itzak: If there is something with a subject: talking about 3 new demands being formulated/proposed/worked upon. A real catchy subject. Something with several paragraphs to get people involved. Yahoo group is fine, but people join the group, they have been involved, and they lower their level of involvement because they have things to do. Between those circles, maybe we can get more people.

Leah: I actually think that without meaning to, we get fragmented because people are attached to their demand and not so much of a community. I know we’re so busy taking action and taking things to the GA but the most important thing is that we hang together and develop an identity and have time to develop as a group.

Cecily: I was going to suggest solidarity drinking be done after meeting possible, especially that we make a point to end meeting on time or earlier. We’re out of time.

Josh: I’m new, and what I’ve noticed that they’re a lot of passion but the macroscopic view. If we want to package these. One is a preamble, or that has one.

Cecily; That should be on the agenda for next time.

Maybe could we create a tentative time agenda.


      1. 3 demands: campaign finance, Glass Steagall, and corporate personhood. Tentatively economic security/rights
      2. framework for how we present demands, guidelines. We want some kind of cohesion. We’ll discuss.
      3. Once a week meetings/frequency of meetings
      4. outreach (OWS forum, in general, internal outreach).

Greg: anyone want to sign up for economic security/rights?

Cecily: any more announcements? This meeting is adjourned.

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