NYCGA Minutes 1/1/2012

Posted by & filed under Assemblies, General Assembly Minutes.


Date/Time: 1/1/12, 7pm

Location: 59 Williams (kicked out of 100 Williams)

Facilitators (F): Brett

[Note: These are raw minutes, they will be edited and formatted as soon as possible.]

F: … fifteen minute proposal. At that time I’ll take a temperature check to see if we want to continue. What I’d like to do now is see if Housing is ready to propose the metrocard funding proposal. Is Housing here?

?: I am from Housing. Is there anyone else here from Housing aside from myself and James?

F: We’ll take a few minutes to let housing figure their stuff out and move on with the agenda.  I’d like to go to Occupy Chicago and hear their proposal.

OC: Hello Occupy family, I’m Sugar and I hail from the windy city. We have formed a national working group and have developed an Occupy state of the union address.

F: Before we continue I saw a PoP to suggest that maybe we don’t need the human mic. It would move things alon gif we could all move in and use natural projection

OC: So we have developed… and the advantage is to take advantage of a once a year opportunity… record people reading the speech, since we have no leader, edit together and the moment the Rep rebuttal is aired, to explode it all over the internet. People would have to come to the internet to find it. Try to keep 8it as tight as possible to keep speech out of media… requesting that when speeches are made at Gas, not to post them online, protect the language so it doesn’t get coopted. We do have set up a secure server4, people ready to edit, amazing wonderful stuff, hashtags, etc etc. The speech concept in theme is Occu0y as a state of mind: economy, ways to engage; designed to speak to the people for where they are at… in line with our ideals but not taking actions due to lack of local occupies, physical reasons, etc, that keeps them from participating. Now I would like to read the speech .

F: I want to take a moment since I kinda jumped into the assembly to set our process a little bit, make sure we’re all on the same page on how we’ll go through the consensus process. As we just did, we have a presentation from a proposer. Then we will open clarifying questions that should be geared towards the proposal, not personal inquiries. Once we’ve exhausted all clarifying questions, feel we understand the proposal, we will open concerns stack. Concerns can be for the proposal or the movement, not the proposer personally… then we move to Fas, usually informed by concerns. Fas can alleviate concerns. It is the discretion of the proposer to acce3pt or reject a FA. If it’s accepted, it’s considered Friendly.

PoI: Sometimes we put concerns and Fas together.

F: Sure, we can do that. Once we finish with Fas we will ask the proposer to restate their proposal succinctly with any Fas. Once they do that we will take a TEMPERATURE CHECK to see generally how the GA feels about this proposal. {uptwinkels] I like it, I agree with it, I want it move forward. [middle] not sure [down] I don’t like it. Based on the read of the GA … a block, we ask, to be framed as a serious moral, ethic or safety concern that involves the movement as a whole. And if this proposal should move forward, you would consider leaving the movement. … Fas can lift a block. If a block decides to hold, we will potentially open concerns and Fas, or we can move to a process called modified consensus which is effectively a vote, we will count the total number of people present in the assembly. Then we will count the number of people blocking and those who want it to go forward. The blocks must exceed ten percent for the movement to not

PoI: It must be ten percent, not greater than. Second, we don’t usually go back to concerns when a block is presented.

F; True… ?

PoP: Anthony clarified that when we’re doing a 9/10 vote, it’s not just blocks, it’s if you don’t like it too, and stand-asides.

CQ: Can you list the whole agenda for us before we move on?

F: Sure, here are the proposals that have checked in. State of the Union, Occupy NH primary, funding for metrocards from Housing resolution to end corporate personhood, Jan 17 solidarity proposal, proposal to examine process that examines the validity of blocks, and Occupy Newark. Those the ones that are checked in, there are a handful that haven’t checked in but I’m only dealing with the ones who have. Alejandro is taking stack, if you have a cq, please go ahead and catch his attention, or better, if you could come up…

GA ?: Wait, she wants to read her statement first.

F: Oh, ok, go ahead.

OC: Can we get a temperature check for the GA not livestreaming the verbiage of the statement? We don’t demand but want the GA to agree to it. We just don’t want it to get out to anyone until the day of.

F: Ok, can we get a temperature check? [mostly good, not everyone participating]

F: What about minutes? [I agreed for Minutes not to include it] Livetweets? [Also not LTing the verbiage]

OC: This is the speech… [NOTE: until this action, the verbiage won’t be posted in the minutes]

Interrupted by girl on phone: Sorry, NLG announcement.

F: Does anyone have information on someone named Matthew Stevenson. There’s been an arrest, NLG is on the phone trying to get that person’s information. Those with social media, can you tweet, ask for info… ok , there are ten names. Livestream can come back. Wait, no, they don’t want that. [writing down the names] Sorry, thank you for your patience, this is an urgent situation.

[pause, crowd chats, F gets names]

F: Ok, so what we’re doing, we’re going to collect all the names and announce them all at once. In the meantime, we’ll hear the rest of the speech.

[speech continues, will post after action]

F: Ok, before we continue, there were a few interruptions, so I’m slightly clearer on exactly how much time we’ve spent so far. What I’d like to do is get a temperature check if we’d like to have a discussion regarding this proposal and this statement. If everyone could participate that would be great. If we want to go through the consensus process. To begin with, let’s give another ten minutes to this discussion. That looks pretty mixed. How about another five, that looks much better. And livestream can come back up. What we’ll do now is open stack on CQs for4 this proposal.

CQ: Will we have a chance to edit it?

A: It’s been put together by a … we are requesting that it be as is. Having gone through occupies from CA thru Midwest and east coast.

CQ: Julian: I personally love this idea, I was moved by the comments, … on voting? MY question is what was raised earlier, but if there were a way we could change a few things, that would be perfect.

A: We wanted to emphasize voting… way for people to express their voice. And not to rally speak to those who are converted, so to speak. And what we wanted to emphasize was for people to express their voice because if we finally do get money out of politics…

Hermez: I just wanted to know if you’re requesting financial help?

A: No. Volunteers are volunteering their time, serving space….

Tim: What national General Assembly is your working group a part of ?

A:  I don’t think one exists….Trying to get feedback from people who aren’t physically occupying a space…trying to get info from people who are not physically occupying, and from the general public

Christine:  It sounded kind of like, demands….I also think it’s very long and should be edited.

Stephen: Which occupies has this been workshopped with?

A: we have San Francisco, chicago, national occupy the hood groups, we went through omaha, a city that I can’t recall off hand, albany, and notes from people through OWS since I’ve been here….

[can’t hear question]

A: Is there a rewording that would make that more comfortable for you? ….

Anthony: I feel concerned getting people into national politics…it’s a fair game, you could have….at the end it says get involved in politics, run for office, etc. and though i would love for us to live in a country where you wouldn’t  get poisoned or manipulated or bought against your will, we do.

A: How else would you like to encourage the general public to participate?

A: Personally I think homelessness solves a lot of problems and I advocate it all the time.

F: We have three people on stack, we’ve reahed the five minutes, I’d like to take a  temp check on using another 5 minutes on this proposal.

Sugar: I don’t want to nitpick, but the proposal itself is about participating in the video aspect of this, where ows would send the video out to the general public.

F: Before we move on i have to take a temp check on continuing this conversation for another 5 minutes.

[question of whether we can move inside, since it’s started raining…]

F: are people interested in continuing this discussion?

[temp check pretty mixed]

F: Do we want to move under the overhang?

[temp check looks positive]

F: If you would like to continue having this discussion for another 5 minutes please let that be known by putting one hand in the air.

F: if you are not interested in having this conversation for another 5 minutes please put one hand in the air.

F: we are going to continue this discussion for another 5 min

Tim: my question is..what directly democratic structure exists to create a national working group and then speak for all of the occupies regardless of whether you have buy-in from all the other occupations?

A: I reached out to whatever e-mail i had, they reached out to whatever emails they hand, and together we worked on it and thats what we have .

Zack: Will you be making this video with  the words you have regardless of whether you get consensus from this GA?

A: The goal is to get as many occupies in as possible…..[They will go forwards with as many as they can.]

[question: unintelligable]

A: If you have ideas on how people can voice that without being at a physical occupy, we’d love to have someone to work with on that.

Stephen: how many occupies have endorsed this so far?

A: We just finished the final wording earlier. You guys are the first this is being proposed to, Chicago is tomorrow, as soon as we can get to other cities…that will happen.

Q: Who are the people you’ve talked to and how did they represent themselves as ows? I have a concern about you saying we’ll give you language but if you meet with groups that’s not the voice of ows…

A: if you look at the timing, the state of the union is on the 24tht…I’ve been on the ground, shown it to people at the office…shown it to as many people as possible.

Q: I’m a revolutionary, not a reformer  I have concerns about the sensitive nature of the proposal, but it’s very good because it appeals to the masses of the people…I agree that voting is not the best process I’m into removing that bit, but it’s 99 percent good and i think its very sensitive  and very appealing to the masses…and if we  could a subscript that says this is not what all the revolutionaries feel….

POI: As a fellow occupier I have to say I’m an individual…[not speaking for the movement]

A: [this is not exactly what I would do, but it appeals to the masses.]

F: i would like to keep the stack and limit back and forth

[Someoene wants to make an announcement ]

Ammpuncement: Happy new year everybody, and thank you so much for making liberty mountain!

Anne: I don’t think anyone here  disagrees with the general content, people have their own methods, suggesting that people vote isn’t more of a demand than suggesting that people occupy. I think people are reading too much into the language. .

F: We have again reached our five minutes. Temp check: do we want to continue? We’ll go to concerns then friendly amendments on this agenda item?

[temp check looks mixed.}

F: I don’t’ feel comfortable taking up another 5 minutes of peoples time given that temp check, if people want to take to sugar about the individual language outside of the assembly….

[confusion about process, what 5 more minutes means ]

F: So I would like to move on to another agenda item….

[Sugar wants clarification on process…says she’s had it done different]

[couple PoP]

PoP: [The facilitator can’t table an issue.]

F: I’ll be honest, I’m a little tired….I’m human just like the rest of us and I’m trying to be clear and I hope that I am.  It has been the tradition of this community to ask for temp on whether we’d like to keep having the discussion.  …The body collectively is tabling an agenda item…

Sugar: we just have a different process in chicago.

Tim: We need to get through every part of the process or else we can’t consense.

F: Jumping to ask for consensus without taking the time to voice concerns and ask for amendments is not fair to the body or the prop.

F: there is not overwhelming desire to complete this conversations….so what I’m asking now is does this group of people here want to take another 5 min to continues the concsesnuse process.  Then we’ll move to concerns and friendly amendments  …again that looks more negative than positive.  There is one statement that the proposer has asked to make…

Sugar: the concept from the national working group was to remove massive blocks that wouldn’t be part of the movement as a whole…if every city is going to have to rework the document, realisticaly, logistically, it wont work.  We’ll take some notes but we have to get a final draft…..if it keeps getting reworked it won’t work…the video won’t get out.

F: Moving forward with the agenda, if you’d like to get int touch with sugar, get her contact info and talk to her about it…Next we’ll go to the housing proposal.

Jeff: Good evening.  We have a proposal but before we get started I want to wish everyone a happy new year.  So the housing group would like to continue the process of producing weekly metro cards for people who are part of tangible operations with the movement…We’d like to do this for another week,..each week we’ve been asking for less and less money…last week we had 120 cards and this week we’d like to purchase 100 new cards at 29 dollars each…thats 2900 of new funds….it’s a total of 130 cards, thats a reduction of 10 cards form las t week…this is part of a process of establishing new cards using the process we started last week…each person who requests a metro cards needs an authorization form signed by someone in a working will be distributed on a first come first serve basis.  We’ll do it at spokes ad GA, previously we were handing them out at 60 wall during ga w’d like to stop going that…only on the days of tuesa wed thursdya, so we can stop carrying metro cards all week.People who have received a metro card last week are required to prove that they still have it …if you received your card in the previous week you have to show you still have it.  If you would like documentation..we now have a document in the housing working group.

So. The proposal is for 2900 dollars plus the metro cards from last week

F: We’re going to move to clarifying questions

Anne: I’m wondering why some people get metro cards to get here.

A: the idea behind the metrodcards it that people who are part of the working group…so we as a movement would facilitate their metro cards.  For actual GA, we’re not giving metro cards for people to get to GA.

POI: Livestream is a working group. I’m jobless, I’m full time, this is the way I get to events to live stream, I can’t even explain how important this is.

Nathan: you said the W G would be responsible…is there a criteria for whether they sign or not?

J: this is the first week we’ve implemented the policy.  And it meant one of two things, One we weren’t really enforcing…the real idea isn’t’ that a single person would decide who gets cards…if a working group decides how they want to give those cards away, if they want to decided by rock paper scissors, that’s their thing.   If someone is from a WG and has a connncetiong with the housing working group, we only decide if they’re a working group.

Lauren: I’m wondering how housing got involved with giving out metro cards…there’s a lot more people than 100 who are making operational and logistical commitments…so all I say continuously is that you’re creating more of a monster than you were, making yourself an offshoot transportation working group.

[We’re being asked to leave the space…..move to another space about a block away.  A discussion begins about whether it’s appropriate to continue making decisions, given that the location of the meeting is no longer public]

F: I’d like to take a straw poll on whether we’re comfortable continuing.  About 25 are comfortable continuing. If you are not comfortable continuing this assembly because we have to keep moving please raise your hand. The concern is that we’re moving and people may not know where it’s happening. If you have a concern raise your hand. I count 8-10 people interested in not continuing. So I think that means we should continue.

[Interrupting mic check]

F: what I would love to do..we are a body of people who don’t feel overwhelming consensus passing proposals we should move to the space, I think we should do Working Group Report backs, , announcement, hear proposals…[but not try to get consensus on them] if the body doesn’t feel comfortable passing proposals we should not do that.

[some question of where we should go, while their we should stay, what’s going on. people talking over each other]

[concern about people knowing where we are – current location not posted]

[GA moves to another location]

F: now that we’re here we should have a temp check inn whether we’d like to  hear proposal without voting.

?: I would like to suggest that any proposal passed would have to be ratified at another GA.

?: The only reason that we are concerned is because of actions take by outside forces. Nypd building orders we ourselves are adhering to the principles of our move if we do not move forward were letting other people dictate…

?: Id like to make a suggestion for full transparency if we could have volunteers stationed at zucotti and 100 Williams..

?: There ate many spaces veritable for our ga so what are we talking about it

We’ve moved this meeting four times, none of which were on the website , or posted to comhub, so this is no longer a public meeting , it’s a group of people moving from place to place.

?: I’ve been with this movement from the beginning it’s a ever been easy to have a gA…the precursor to the NYC GA we got chased numerous times in one day that’s the nature of the beast.

F: ok we’ve heard lots of concerns and support so let’s take a temp check on how the body feels about continuing this ga

[temp check]

F: ok so I would then like to do this as a straw pole, so the first question is do I feel comfortable continuing this as a GA, and second count is that I would like this to be a space of discussion and not an official GA.

F: please just bear with me through this. For the record I counted 38 people comfortable with continuing . So who’s not comfortable continuing?

F: okay, so there were between 14 and 17 people comfortable continuing.  It’s not 9/10 consensus, but it’s a temp check that’s pretty mixed. It wasn’t overwhelming so I’m not comfortable doing that, I think we should keep discussing the proposals without trying to reach consensus. And then we can do a short stack

?: I have a wrong feeling on why we should continue as a Ga. The only power we have is the power to spontaneously decide things.

[talking over each other.]

?: We should keep in mind that we have….we don’t have to keep doing stuff just to prove that you can. Were not in a good position, there are people who don’t know where we are.

Nan: I have three proposals tonight, it’s been moved four times, to talk about my prop since we’ve moved four times and people don’t know where we at…they texted me I don’t know what to tell them.

?: Our park got taken last night. We are the people standing here today. This is not a campaign you people are supposed to be here.

F: I would like to bring this back we have a lot of concerns being raised. That should not trump that we are a community, we should function as a community, respecting all voices. Tim has been waiting.

Tim: I felt strongly if people don’t feel comfortable calling this meeting accessible, w need to respect this. We need a mechanism to deal with this, like maybe having a system to spread the word so everyone feels comfortable in the belief that this is accessible so why don’t we talk about this?

F: Before we continue there’s a pressing issue we need to address. The NLG has given us a list of names we need more info about.

NLG: I need to know if this person was arrested, or no.

‘Matthew Stevenson

Michael bible


Johnny. At

Priscilla Tompkins

Anthony Venezia

Midh mora

Brian McKinley

Brian walker


F: I’d like to go to stack. Alejandro is here , he will start to collect names.

Alejandro: I’ve seen enough GAs dissolve into a lot of different kinds of things, this is not that extraodrdinatry that we find ourselves in this predicament, and our responsibility is to pass resolution that WG do do diligence to, I just feel like we’re struggling to find a way to make decisions, the system is making all kinds of decisions that effect us….There will still be roadblocks that keep us from…the NDAA was signed yesterday .

F: before we move to stack I was just given the info that the current location will be put up on comhub, do people know where we are?

Audrey: I’d like to talk about the experience…after the action it’s hard to come together and have a civilized conversation, we’re lot a lot of people…so if everyone wants to take a deep breath.

I have som experience pith having to move GAs around….we’d liteleratlly have to be in a different place in every night….in my experience is new york is that….if people were on time, at the park , at 7, and they’re not there, who cares? I’ve been so frustrated in New York, you go to spokes ,you go to GA, and if feels like a huge waste of time.  If were going to be a decision-making body, and zuccotti is closed, we decide where we’re going…but if you’re not on time for GA and you’re not ready to  talk about the proposals on time…then Fuck You!

Nan: Since we have moved four times and I’m really concerned that we’re moving again and again before the time is over….We have a GA constantly making sure  things are going right, I’m going on feeling…I do not feel that we can have a proposal here when we keep moving like this.  I think we should have a regular Speak-out, soapbox…

Stan: every day between the hours of 1-6 PM, think tank meets in Zucotti and Atrium…i’m part of a WG called the think tank, we’re trying to find solutions like this, we could have a discussion there instead of here.  This is what we call a GA.  We don’t have decision-makig powers right now…so if you want to talk like this we do it every single day

Stewart: The confusion here….its probably not a place to make decisions right here.  But I’d like to bring up my proposal….From Occupy New Hampshire Primary.   We’re the only occupation not sending people directly right now.  Occupy NH has amazing actions planned.  So if anyone has a person they want to send…

Tyler: First of all, if you’re here, i’ve been listening to you, and if you’re speaking when its my turn to speak I feel very disrespected.  So please listen to whoever’s speaking and if you’re here you’re at the GA which is being facilitated by this guy.  I was not a t Zuccotti right and seven and I took accountability for the fact to get here.

Daniel: I’m in agreement that e continue, a lot of people still don’t’ know whats going on in the 17th.  Occupy DC has endorsed it, he’s from DC and he’s come tonight to make this proposal, and this is something that we can do to bring it to the national level..there are more GAs that will be represented at Occupy Congress.  It’s important that we’re there.  there’s a lot of stuff we can offer, logistics, housing, if you have questions please get in touch with me..there’s a proposal and we have the people to make it happen.

Lorenzo:First thing we consensed on was to rename ZP to Liberty Park, so it hurts my heart  when people don’t refer to it as Zuccotti and not Liberty.

Second: a reminder that GAs are a group or body of individuals.  There’s a little thing about money that’s largely bullshit….Third: we should talk seriously about days after actions that we  don’t have a GA, we should meet , talk about how the action went, and then have the GA then next day when our friends are out.

Yoni: We have the issue here that every timer we get kicked out we’re letting the cops win, letting the authorities win, yesterday I got peppersprayed and it wasn’t comfortable but that’s not the point.  A lot of these proposals are not controversial and I think this could be a valid GA, its bigger than some GAs when we’ve only had a few people  The ones who care about this are the people who are here.  Are those people really dedicated? We should be getting shit done instead of letting people win.

Stephen: my concern is that people have moved four times, it has to do with the safety of GA…when I first got word that we’d moved…we currently have a broken process that we need to fix, but if we start moving the GA and making public decisions we’re not being transparent.

Sage: So I don’t’ know the topic discussion, I only know what I’ve been hearing. Some thoughts that came to mind: of we’re a movement of people that is so divided that 30 people being here isn’t enough, I don’t know if we can be making decisions at all.  I dont know if i can trust this groups to make a decision, but if your values are so different I don’t know if the consensus process is designed for this kind of group, consensus if for people with similar ideas to figure out a way to make smaller decisions. …the second thing is that I really want to just hear if anyone has report backs from what happened yesterday…and I think we can take it down in terms of intensity, if we can agree to make decisions that [omit the amount of money ] taking a temp check and move the F on and have more experience knowing who’s functional and knowing who’s not functional,  and have an actual community, and make decisions as groups, if we can consense to not make any  props over 500 bucks

F: We have three more on stack…as Sage mentioned I think it would be good to have report-backs from what happened last night, additionally we should make a space for WG to have report-backs that they can share with the assembly, as well as the proposers who have showed up, I feel should be able at least to explain and let themselves be available to answer questions, hear concerns .

Diane: Point of information that direct action……If we can have proposals that we can scale down with funding because we need minimal transportation costs it won’t happen…figure something out for things that are time sensitive.

DJ: Okay, I had two points, the first one was, i guess like I’m from occupy Denver and Boulder, we’re had similar problems….is there any president for disbanding a GA.  If you set that precedent it’ll happen again and again…if you don’t feel comfortable individually…if you feel comfortable please bring it, [the police chief, Bloomberg making decisions that affect our movement, we need to make decisions too]

Nan: um, I just want to make a quick announcement: tomorrow we’re gonna start a liberty square union general assembly…sometimes in the morning between 1 and 4 we’re going to have a general assembly… it’s another form that’s coming out of the GA, and I want to invite everybody at 1 tomorrow for….liberty square Union’s general assembly.

Tim: I  feel like we have a structural misunderstanding thats leading to a lot of this conflict.  In order for us all to keep moving forward together we need to be of the same mind about doing that, we need a structure that allows people to know what’s going on…..We don’t have a mechanism to do those things accountably.  People are constantly coming to GA asking us to consent on things we can’t consent to. We can’t.  No one group can speak on federal issues that affect every one of those issues.  We need to have that convo fist before we can have any of their conversations…..the people from the state of the union working group…said it will be too much work to go and collaborate with every GA…thats not how we operate, if there’s no mechanism to do that.  Let’s focus on making processes to make this stuff happen first.

F: What i’d like to do right now….I’d like a temp check to read through the proposals that were on the agenda tonight.  So everyone knows what was on the agenda, and if you’re interested in talking with those proposers about their agenda, but we won’t use our collective space to do this.

POP: Generally, if you’re a facilitator you have to say it’s yr opinion..

F: Yes! Because this body has expressed concern with trying to reach consensus on these proposals we should give space for proposals to be presented for informational purposes.  And that we allow five minutes for each proposal.

Q: [unclear]

F: Ihere is concern that we cannot fine-tune…The most recent temp check that I took….So what I am proposing that we do is that proposers have come, I’m trying to give space to those proposals and honor that those people showers up, but decisions will not be made until Tuesday.

?: some people want feedback

F: this would be a chance for proposers to get feedback, ask questions, so when they come back the info has been put out there.  For educational purposes.

[ unclear direct response ]

F: we took a temp check.  This body could not consense on whether if felt comfortable making decisions as a GA.

?: I rode a bicycle from Maine to hear this man speak.  Please respect me. I have given my life to respecting you.

F: to be clear I’ve used a straw pole rather than a temp check, it’s a way to get how the crowd feels, it’s phrasing a temp check in a different way.  I feel like as a GA, I feel like we’ve already established that this groups is not comfortable making decisions.

F: It has been requested that I step down.  Temp check?

[looks bad.]

F: I would like two take a temp check to see if people want to give 5 minutes for each proposal to get feedback outside of the GA space.

[temp check]

F: That looks v. positive.  Are there concerns with moving on to do that ?

Concern: if we can’t make decisions tonight this is a mockery of the whole thing.

F: The concern has been raised.

Q: the metro card thing….was that supposed to start this tuesday.

Jeff: [yes, it’s time sensitive.}

C: some proposals are time sensitive and should be heard in that manner.

Q: I’m confused with thats going on right now…what I’m getting is that there was mixed signals that if we wanted to continue the GA, so this is not an official GA technically so to me in the essence of asking if we want to continue the GA kind of permits us not having a GA at the same time.  If we have a temp check about whether we want to have a GA and it’s mixed that means were not having a GA…..[didnt get the info about having a GA until very late] the point is we need to continue and if we’re not gonna…lets not talk about not talking about the proposals.

guy: i want to make a statement thats about what’s happening tin the movement, as well as tonight and this is a personal point and ill make it quick were trying to build a better world not a perfect world. anything we do there will be certain gaps, but it think its important that as a group we continue to move, rather than stopping a and dropping everything, move on given what we have….you just have to keep everything going even if its not perfect.

F: so to clarify what we’re doing, since there was concern about what we’ve been doing as a decision-making body…trying to figure out how to utilizes our collective time…there are ways to move forwards that are respectful of our time, using our time.  The only thing that there has been overwhelming agreement on…..[someone points out there was no temp check on that]

F: so i proposed a way to use our time.  we can do another temp check because we moved away from it a little bit and may not be remembering it as accurately as i thought. i move that we give space to the proposers.

[disagreement offer whether they can propose]

F: I’m suggesting that we give 5 minutes for any proposers who are still here to propose for informational purpose, because there was concern over whether we should make decisions .

F: let’s take a temp check on that, giving proposers space for their proposal.

[Temp check}

F: as a temp check that was overwhelmingly positive. Are there concerns with using our time that way?

[unclear Q]

F: because there were people here before that weren’t comfortable before, I don’t want to take another temp check…if when people leave we reopen the conversation that’s problematic.

F: The most recent temp check we took gave 5 minutes to each proposer. there was overwhelming support for using our time that way, so i like to open stack for proosersals at 5 min each and we will move through those proposals.

[more on stack from the last conversation ]

[Nan thanks facilitation for having “the balls” ]

Nan: like you said before there were more people having that conversation, and if they don’t feel comfortable, that’s not the process, i feel uncomfortable doing another temp would you feel if you had your say, came back and realized that this wasn’t accountable?

POP: I thought this was about the proposals

[some back and forth about that]

F: So now stack is open.

F: We’re taking time, we’re gonna do five minutes.  If the proposers could give info about how you could be available to answer questions and concerns.

Politics and Electoral Reform: We put out a resolution that I passed around if someone didn’t get a copy….so this is a general resolution that we wanted to pass tonight and we wanted to get feedback…the resolution effectively calls for losing corporate personhood, as may of you know about 32 years ago the supreme court passed a decisions granting access to let them donate to political party campaigns anonymously.  They have more power now….there is a movement right now thats being a passed locally to pressure congress into amending that decisions..the LA city council has recently passed a resolution for their city council that was days after occupy LA.  This one is basally modeled after that…this is a chance for occupy to take a stand..othehr occupations have passed it ….this month the city council is passing a resolution to end corporate personhood.  We will have a voice on…there’s gonna be a nationwide campaign and rallies occupying the courts, all the federal courts across the country, there will be 2, Jan. 20 and Jan. 22.  You should all have a copy of this, i want to stress this is one of many…it would encourage a lot of people, including people not involved with occupy Wall street. We’ll bring this now Tuesday night for occupy wall street. We’d like to have your feedback, your input, your support

This is not the city  council resolution this is a resolution that occupy wall street could make, to clarify its position that is not the city council position but is parallel.

Tim: How can we make sure that this resolution while making clear our stand on the actual type of entity a corporation is, and doesn’t have the same inalienable right to speak, how can we do that without going against our general-seeming consensus against….engaging with the existing system.  I think the idea that corporations are people is abysmal, but i’m afraid of making too [heavy] a stance about what kinds of systems we’re willing to engage in.

F: thats five minutes, if you could get contact info on how people can reach you…

I would really love feedback. Email is… You can text me 347-987-0975.  I would love feedback from you guys and I’ll be right over there.  You can also contact EndCorportatepersonhoodnyc@

Next: Dan and Ben, DC

DC: Good evening, thanks for sticking around to give us some time to talk to you about the 27th of January.  If anyone remembers when we had take back the capital, it was a point to organize national gas. on the 17th there will be more participants from more GAs.

So i’m gonna run through a quick schedule for the day, and then we’ll have questions, whatever

in the morning at 9am, in the next few weeks we’ll have people set up meetings with their reps, there are supportive lobbyists helping us  …..we’re gonna have an occupation share in the afternoon, where people can talk about their best practices…I love being in new york with you, btu we have two awesome camps in DC with libraries, food, comfort.  So bring a tent and come hang out.  Around three or four we’re gonna have an inter-occupy spokescouncial as well as a ga . At take back the capital we had 26 occupations and we expect more this time.  And throughout the afternoon more inter-occupy action, hopefully some actions against various lobbying group, and at 6 we’re gonna have our big mass mobilization march, we’re expecting about 1000 people ,we’d love for people from new york, which has been so inspiring , to come down. your structure here is interesting, dynamic.

We’re nota asking for an endorsement, just your participating.   Even if you’re not into engaging with representative democracy, you should come .  We want to have an active participation about whats going on across the country…we need to talk about doing things, but we need actions to give us the lifeblood of the  movement. So having presence is very important . We’re just asking for participation

I’ll be able to help with food and transport, so if you have questions now, let me ask.  And if you have personal questions about food, et.c

Q: what are you with in DC?

A: I’m from McPherson square, but there asre also people at Liberty…This is really becoming a movement-wide action.

We have New Mexico, Occupy San Fransisco…

Q: the food situation, will you be providing it, or will bee bring our own ….

A: At the two camps we have a kitchen infrastructure but with larger group of people its important for us to get a count of what we’ll have….

Our contact info email  I will defs respond to anything.

And I’ll be here at GA.  its

Next: NH

NH: I want to say thanks to facilitation cause its been a tough one.  So I’m gonna read through the thing I would usually read at GA

I’m Stewart with political action working group we’re arranging a trip to the national primary. we’ll occupy NH from 1/5 to 1/10 and the many actions they have planned. We will not endorse any party, any candidate. We will be the eye in NH.  The french press has already interviewed us .  It ‘s a great opportunity to work with many oppupiers from across the country, the North East.  Its’ a good way to protest the system without being a part of it…..Occupy did want some [money] but we’ll bring that up on Tuesday. We’re still looking for tech people to do live stream…its a small, crowded place, but we need our voice…here’ amy email: ronnsnleonard@gmail.  Or look up our political action working group on nycga. ANy questions?

Q: What do you need?

We need bodies, tech support

Next on stack: Im from occupy newark, have a request for funds, for supplies to help us…the prop is for $10,000….we have permission from the city council to stay at our encampment downtown…we invite y’all to one and check it out, I’m gonna try to make a proposal on Tuesday.

Q: there was an idea that you [had trouble at the camp]….what kind of vibe its here?

A: [unclear]

we have reason to believe that the city council is ….they haven’t made a decisions……unless we do something we’re going to stay/

Stewart: Contact info:

next: Nan

Nan: hey guys I have three proposals tabled. the first proposal that i had that was tabled started yesterday basically it was for finance and I think it was important to audit finance, but I don’t trust the finance team, and the IRS loves auditing people . I started a proposal last night but it was New Years’ so everyone was in a party mode. …I want to get he okay to audit finance, with complete ternasparancy.

Second: dispose of the spokes council. because is excluding people, marginalizing people, forcing people to be in working groups, and they’ve been  marginalizing me , there was an coincident last friday where i was excluded and then physically assaulted.

Facilitation: I wasn’t to table that, and I’m working with the facilitation team, and some of the people i like and some that I don’t like.

Q: the auditing in accounting, thats’s something that should be extended to every working group, everybody.  So i would rather it go forward as something [movement wide]

A: since accounting keeps every working group’s books, We want to make are were aren’t doing anything illegal, people aren’t laundering money overseas because the cops love that ,and we want to make sure we’re legit, because eventually we will face the IRS, we want to make sure our house is clean, in order to go forward with this movement. Having our house clean we can above ground and we don’t know whose giving and that their motivation is and what they’re giving.  For us, the money is accountable, but we need transparency to the world, and that those who are giving know how we’re spending it, and they can trust us and we can have that community together.

Contact: Strong Women Rules Working Gorup @ or at

Nan: I’m not doing no direct response.

F: so that timed up pretty well with our five minutes.  If we have WG report backs, announcements, or if people want to say something about last night we can do a a general stack.

Jesse: I wanted to talk about physically the way we operate here, and some of the stuff that we do day after day, it’s the same ones and, and some of it is really minuscule, but it translates to something really huge, and for us to continue to come to consensus on really big things, actions, money ,things like that, but I think we need to address the functionality ….This process is broken and even though folks feel a lot of these things we need to focus on our process a lot more so it’s an easy  buy-in for everybody else.  Like tonight with the whole movement of the Ga, we couldn’t really get that right, and it disspoleved. If we can’t attend to simple things I can’t see us attending to anything huge, So maybe i should work on a prop to address that

A: 5:30 on Fridays Structure Working group meets to talk about those try things.

Livestream: I guess we can do Livestream report-back, we covered the liberty park really well, there was a noise demo that was streamed, another person was on that march later on, one of our members was arrested and thrown in the paddy wagon.  Also Livestream, part of our larger thing is figuring out how to have a media collective that could operate on its own, we want everyone to know about that, we want to fundraise to buy better equipment  figure out how different organizations model, etc. that’s it

Noni: so yes was both the noise demo and liberty park, first GA and then a demo stations, the noise demo went really well, we had five arrests, it was scary how the cops just kind of showed up immediately, beating people up. The police were really trying to intimidate people, clearing the whole park, attacked me and three other NLG, they were just going beyond, and it was really redic, i wish i’d anticipated that, it felt like occupy 1984 and it was really disgusting.  and we need a mechanism to make sure everything is recorded , but we also need a much stronger legal basis, because it was a massive violating …….they said the park would open at 9am, but it isn’t open yet, and its a violating

Al: i saw yoni last night and with his eyes burning at the barricades, and was facing the cops, and [cop asked if moving barricades made them feel ok, they said YES ]

Frankie: Yesterday with everyone that was on the inside the park, there were a lot of people in solidarity going on a march . At the same time protestors being antagonized, left the park, went on a march, actually someone I knew very well, arrested, all she did was move something and the cops just came and arrested her.  At the same time a lot of stuff was happening at the same time, i see this one girl, she was….cop had her knee on the top of there back, i love this movement so much but when i get elbowed in the face ill just keep on marching. ok, so we have a big march and we get all split up in the moment, it’s so crazy over there, were actually fighting for what we believe in, we’re worrying about the money and transparency,, and things that are happening with money, some are marching, others are in the streets fighting, and we’re the ones at the front battle lines and way up in the occupy office, people are up there watching this on live stream, its crazy how different occupies are.  when it moves to centralization..spokescouncil…when we come to a centralized …at the same time we’re pushing our fellow occupiers in different directions, some of them stay in diff occupies, some stay in the streets of nyc, why can’t we just get a centralization.  We have a direct action lets make a DA XXX or some shit.  They may have prior arrests and shit they have to deal with in other states and they’re in rikers right now because they came to ows and couldn’t get a metro card, we’re not able to keep them in the process, one thing i mentioned on the 17th is  why don’t we have a mobile GA? I’m not saying we need ….we need occupiers in all boroughs……we can do all this, the one thing I was worried about was people feeling like they’re marginalized but they have had the opportunity to come and be able to participate …..they keep coming back and forth from the church and they can’t be involved…it’s like ….it’s moving, look at movements, they get raided and raided and they’re still there.  We only got raided once.  …drums circle…they may have taken the drums from us but you can’t take the beat our of zuccotti.  You say the park is public but now we can’t get inside of it? and then we need to stop putting ourselves in other people’s shoes.  OK you guys come to GA or spokes, guys want to stand up for what you think is right, but….its about what he or she thinks is right, you put up a POI or a block and…we’re all in this together. You might not see my face, or their faces, tomorrow. they’re trying to get rid of us, stop the differences.  Hey, need money, fuck it , get a job.  We’re not gonna let this system get us, we’re bringing about change.

[time concern]

i still love you guys, everybody i see here is still occupying.  I’m frankie i’m trying….this is how I feel.  this is my new twinkle,  down twinkles go like this.  Keep it up!

Conner: Hey.  That was awesome. Functionality in GA will attract more people…its an individuals task to keep ethical diligence to the GA….its in the interest of everybody and its for the benefit of the group and ultimately it’s GAs role to make these positive things pass…we should just assume we’re here for generally the same reasons, and our egalitarian reasons for reign here, having a bottom-up movement, if there are 6 props on the table 90 percent of them should be  passing, how can I help with other people’s ideas, how can I help?

[Discussion of PTSD in the movement, after being raised]

Livestream: We’re going to be doing a Q&A, around 11, 1130, live stream/occupynyc …

?: Fucking love live streaming, put your lives on the line putting your cameras in their faces, my CQ is like, i just have to put that out there. Aren’t they doing that? Why are we focused? How do we have technology to join on live stream?

A: We have equipment… if anyone wants to live stream, if you have a smartphone, there’s a how-to-livestream on your phone, we can always put them on our channel, get in contact with us.

?: I was  just going to tie up my stack, all I wanted toe ay is that i’ve noticed like there people have noticed, about focusing on money. Finding ways to spend the money, the more the more the money is there and spent, the more it’ll keep pouring it in. They’ll donate to us as long as we’re transparent and progressive, trying to find ways to solve problem.

?: … nothing else, not real money, really strong movement, when people do bring stuff, it’s usually a process of … blocks are too casual, people don’t even realize the severity of a block. Should this pass… they’re just… should be trying to find a way to use the money… they’re holding onto the money, how do we hold onto it, how do we keep it, people distrust each other. Full accountability, yeah sure, we should be, but we shouldn’t be distrusting each other, we should be finding ideas to solve problems.

F: What I’d like to do is since have reached the end of stake, I’d like to call an official end of this body of people. whatever we are. e heard some amazing things tonight, there are some structural things we need to address as a community. Structure meets, Facilitation meets, formal meeting at 4pm every day, WG meetings T, Th, Sat at 4 at the Atrium. We also have a team, doesn’t it look like fun? I’d like to thank everyone for sticking it out, being a part of the conversation, even though we didn’t spend any money or express solidarity, I feel like we did really well tonight. That is my personal opinion, if you’d like to talk to me about how this meeting went, I’ll be at the atrium from four on. I’ll stick around for a little bit now, but I’m tired, honest about that. Thank you all!

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